Banned from AF

[JustinP10]

Originally posted by Geo


I don't know nuthin'.... I just work here.

That is AWESOME! HAHAHAHAHHAHA Sorry, for some reason I found that VERY amusing. (Probably because I hear that at work like every 5 minutes.

And for the other stuff, the SE-R Mailing list has been around a LOT longer than the g20.net website or the AF forum, that has helped bring a lot of people together. Every year there is a National Convention held somewhere in the US, which easily brings in over 100 members from all over North America. I know i'll make it to every convention possible from here on out. I've made the past 2 out of 3 conventions, and i'm already hooked, have been since the first night in Dallas two years ago.

I'd have to guess that most of the knowledge will most likely migrate to this forum, however, I'm sure many people will still stay on the AF forum too. I'll still browse there and check out the classified and other forums, unless I get booted from AF too.

[napakapa]

Life is like this, when money is involved, people argue about the money. Igor wants to keep G20.net from moving out because he doesnt want to lose the traffic from G20 owners which are big majority in AF. When he sees that he cant keep G20.net from moving out, he isnt happy. Simple as that as I see. If Brian had said "we will pay you $1000 each month after we moved out", then there will not be a single problem at all. But this banning Brian and Jason can show what kind of person Igor is.

[b-b00gie]

In response to the numerous posts I've read on AF of him saying that we dont know how much it costs to run a forum or the costs of bandwidth... we know *exactly* what it costs.


But you know what? Little does he know whats going on in the background. We've been provided with unlimited bandwidth. Post all you want. Have all of AF post here all that they want!


I'm proud and honored that David Evans (B15Sentra.net owner) has introduced me to Matt Hunt (SR20DE.org). Matt runs his own ISP and now G20.net is run and sponsored in a way by the same great people who are making SR20DEForum.com and B15Sentra.net happen.

Why is that "other" place constantly concerned about the $$$, all we're here for is free information, time, and dedication to G20's.


Matt & David, I know you're reading... Thanks so much!

[RCer]

This is how I see things.

I got to AF because a link on G20.net, and I think most of us got there that way. I might be wrong but that's my point of view.
When I got to AF, the only forum that was alive was G20, with more than 80% of all the post.
After that, Igor got the people from skyline forum, that has lost their server, and AF host all those guys. That was a great move, and a great service to them. So, AF grow a little.
Suddenly, AF got the Purehonda forum in, and it was massive. Lots of people (just like Honda), and lots of posts.

So, who made who? I think the only thing AF is doing, is hosting people from differents forums that already exist. Maybe the only one was not organized was US, and yes, they host us for a critical period of time.

I think AF should be gratefull we were there for so long.

Brian, Jason and the rest of the Staff: A big Thank You, and let's keep it going!!!!!!!

PS. I haven't got time for browsing a lot here, but maybe you guys should present officially all the staff. I mean, you have already start, so let's do an official presentation.

[DVS]

It's funny how you talk about Igor this way behind his back, much like how you did in AF. I can't say that I'm surprised though.

First off to each and everyone who's posted on here with the negativity, no one is saying you can't go out and venture on your own! You obviously aren't seeing the point that is being made or you are just naive. No one including myself has said that it was a bad idea about Brian and Jason creating a forum on their own. The issue that Igor had and many other people had was the way things were done. If Brian and Jason wanted to go out on their own, Igor had no problem with that. But by being secretive about something like this was just plain irresponsible. Both Brian and Jason know very well that what they did violated AF's policy. Just wanting to email their user base is a bunch of crap. That is basically what every other forum does to attract new members. Whether they did it with a malicious intent or not, it was unprofessional.

Second, Igor did what any other Moderator would have done including myself. Spam is not tolerated, period! The fact that it was done while this was happening can easily be used by both Jason and Brian to say that Igor used it to rid them from the forums. This could not be further than the truth. The only opinion that I have with Jason and Brian now is, you both should be ashamed of yourselves.

I leave now because knowing these two, they might just ban people for having a difference of opinion, but know that things a way of working themselves out. Best of luck to both of you on your new business venture.

DVS

[b-b00gie]

DVS,

We're not going to ban you here.



We're talking behind his back? This is the only place we can talk. We were banned from his forum and HE is the one who's talking behind our backs.


There's a lot of people commenting on things they do NOT know:

• I specifically said in my post that I was putting together a list of G20.net users. Anyone that was interested emailed me, those that were not, ignored the thread. I recieved 21 emails.
  
• Igor claims I private messaged 40 people. LIE. At most I messaged 10 or 12 people. These 10 to 12 were mainly people who had contributed reader ride submissions to me, so YES I felt they would be "interested" in knowing of G20.net's new forum. My private messages said: "I thought you may be interested, G20.net now has its own forum" never was anything said to the affect of "dont post on AF, post on G20.net"
  
• Of the 30 people I contacted, most were interested, a few were not. How do we have almost 100 members already?

This has been turned into something its not.


The intent was to form a G20.net forum for those that care about G20.net.


There's just a little too many people forming opinions when they were never involved and dont know both sides of the story.

[DVS]

Originally posted by b-b00gie
DVS,

We're not going to ban you here.



We're talking behind his back? This is the only place we can talk. We were banned from his forum and HE is the one who's talking behind our backs.


There's a lot of people commenting on things they do NOT know:

• I specifically said in my post that I was putting together a list of G20.net users. Anyone that was interested emailed me, those that were not, ignored the thread. I recieved 21 emails.
  
• Igor claims I private messaged 40 people. LIE. At most I messaged 10 or 12 people. These 10 to 12 were mainly people who had contributed reader ride submissions to me, so YES I felt they would be "interested" in knowing of G20.net's new forum. My private messages said: "I thought you may be interested, G20.net now has its own forum" never was anything said to the affect of "dont post on AF, post on G20.net"
  
• Of the 30 people I contacted, most were interested, a few were not. How do we have almost 100 members already?

This has been turned into something its not.


The intent was to form a G20.net forum for those that care about G20.net.


There's just a little too many people forming opinions when they were never involved and dont know both sides of the story.

I posed you a question back in AF, I guess since you were banned you would have been unable to answer it. I will ask you it here, In the conversation that you had with Igor, you said that you believed it was appropriate to at least inform him of what you guys wanted to do. You then said later that because "the others" said no, you changed your decision. Why did you let yourself get manipulated so easily by them? I do not mean this in an offensive way nor am I trying to start problems with anyone. You're also right about the fact that I am not 100% informed on the actual conversation. But I am not coming on here to bash and say this or that. I am basing my claims from what I have seen and how it went down. Bottom line is, it didn't go down professionally. To have members of AF come here and bash Igor or AF this way is childish at best. For those of you who felt that AF wasn't providing you with what you needed, why bother staying? You're just as foolish for doing so.

Second, I'm not going to get into specifics as to how many or what was said. I'm also not taking sides on this. But clearly, metioning another website, be it with your own user base is still in violation of AF's policies. You know that.

I've always been a loner on AF so when I comment, moderate, opinionate, it is my own thoughts that I am expressing. I am not being coerced in anyway with my posting. But I do feel that you should know right from wrong. Just because others persuade you another way doesn't make it right. Again, I'm not basing this off of anything relevant from what took place.

In the end, your forums will be big and you will have a large user base as on AF. I think that when you achieve this level of notariety, maybe then you will reconsider this bridge you have burned. I wish you the best.

[b-b00gie]

Originally posted by DVS

I wish you the best.

Thank you. The feeling is mutual.

[2002G20Racer]

I wish it could have all worked out but I guess not... I will continue to use the Automotive Forums until it falls apart or lose interest in cars (which will never happen). But I will also take advantage of the new resources that can be found on G20.net. I feel that I would rather not chose which side to be on but rather just be on both forums.

[G-Forces]

Originally posted by DVS

Best of luck to both of you on your new business venture.

It's funny that you come in here and you don't really know what's going on. First of all Brian and I are not gaining anything from this 'business venture' as you put it. We are not allowing advertising and ALL money so far has come out of Brian's and my pockets!

Second, I'm not going to get into specifics as to how many or what was said. I'm also not taking sides on this. But clearly, metioning another website, be it with your own user base is still in violation of AF's policies. You know that.

No you are taking sides in this. G20.net was clearly a partner with AF.com. Mentioning G20.net on the site was a violation? Then I was in violation the whole time I was there.

I've always been a loner on AF so when I comment, moderate, opinionate, it is my own thoughts that I am expressing. I am not being coerced in anyway with my posting. But I do feel that you should know right from wrong. Just because others persuade you another way doesn't make it right. Again, I'm not basing this off of anything relevant from what took place.

Secondly the dealings of G20.net are NO business of Igors, period! Should I ask Igor if I can go take a piss now? Brian and I planned to create a new forum and we were preparing to tell Igor everything. In fact I received an e-mail from Brian the day before all this shit went down asking me how we should break the news. I never got a chance to respond. Igor got a bee in his bonnet and went off on a hissy fit. We were going to tell him well before we went public. Believe me or not, I don't really care what you think. Igor is the one that will not listen to reason and that is my stand point. Am I Disappointed? Yeah. Igor was really good to us and I feel bad it came to this. Am I going to go on hands and knees and apoligize? Hell no!

In the end, your forums will be big and you will have a large user base as on AF. I think that when you achieve this level of notariety, maybe then you will reconsider this bridge you have burned. I wish you the best.

Bridges can be burned from both ends. Anyway that's not our goal. See, again you think this is some big fricking conspiricy. We now have the ability to manage the G20 user base and forums in a more convient maner, of which Igor would have never agreed to allow.

The only opinion that I have with Jason and Brian now is, you both should be ashamed of yourselves.

That's really funny! You claim to not take sides and you also claim not to know what exactly transpired. Yet you come in here and try to lecture us from your golden soapbox. I know you and a bunch of those AF.com mods take the site way to seriously.

[G-Forces]

Originally posted by 2002G20Racer
I wish it could have all worked out but I guess not... I will continue to use the Automotive Forums until it falls apart or lose interest in cars (which will never happen). But I will also take advantage of the new resources that can be found on G20.net. I feel that I would rather not chose which side to be on but rather just be on both forums.

I can't speak for Brian but I imagine he feels the same way. It's totally in your right to do that. I have no problem with it. AF.com is/was a great site. I would still visit there had I not been banned. I'm not going to lose any sleep over it however.

[G20-Budo]

Is there any chance we can just drop all this?

Let's just get back to G20 content please..

I'm going to post the same thing to the AF.

[saturntangerine]

Yes, I too came over to see what all this fuss was about.

First off: Just aesthetically, this is dismal. I've described it as "the pits of Hell" because it is just downright miserable in appearance. Sure, the graphics look nice, and it's clean but DAYUM, can we please find the light of day somewhere??? I'm skeered of the dark.

Secondly: As the beloved DVS has said, people were not banned for making a new forum or for springing the idea out at the last minute. People were banned for spamming, which is something I was nearly banned for myself before I became a moderator. I only retained my membership by apologizing profusely to existing moderators, including the bigcheese himself.

Sure, everyone here has handled this immaturely, Igor included. Professionally, making a last-ditch effort to cover @ss after-the-fact was not the way to go, but that's life. We will all move on and realize that all this fighting is stupid. We all love our G20's. We all love talking about our G20s. None of that will change. Some people need to get a life outside of the computer and find that daylight that seems to be hiding somewhere in this blackness... Others just won't change. I personally don't care which you choose. Information is information. So in the end, give up the whining and get something productive done already!




P.S. The G20.net advertising that was incorporated into the AF page was not spamming due to the agreement made. Advertising that is made without permission (especially in excessiveness) is spam, which was against the Guidelines (which are why they exist in the first place.)

[b-b00gie]

Originally posted by saturntangerine

Secondly: As the beloved DVS has said, people were not banned for making a new forum or for springing the idea out at the last minute. People were banned for spamming, which is something I was nearly banned for myself before I became a moderator...

This is completely false.


This is *again* why I say that *people who were not involved are saying things they do not know*

• I was banned while talking to Igor, before ANY message was sent out.
• Jason was banned and did not send out ANY message.

As Kyle already said, we need to stop this. Everyone keep their comments to themselves, believe what you wish and move on.

[G-Forces]

Originally posted by b-b00gie

• Jason was banned and did not send out ANY message.

As Kyle already said, we need to stop this. Everyone keep their comments to themselves, believe what you wish and move on.

True I never thought of that before. I never spammed anyone. I was banned through assosiation. I was away for the week. Finally I'll back Kyle up on this last one too. Anymore AF mods that want to voice their opinion please do so privatly through PM or e-mails.

[kbslacker]

Originally posted by b-b00gie



This is completely false.


This is *again* why I say that *people who were not involved are saying things they do not know*

• I was banned while talking to Igor, before ANY message was sent out.
• Jason was banned and did not send out ANY message.

As Kyle already said, we need to stop this. Everyone keep their comments to themselves, believe what you wish and move on.

Eh, you did post the same post, in every forum. That equals spam.

But anyways, back to what I said earlier. I didnt mean to put your site down Jason. I'm sure it helped tons of people. But I know you were busy, and couldnt update it like you wanted. All I was saying, was all the good content came from the members that posted. So even if I have to get my answers on www.SR20DEforum.com I dont care. As long as I get what I want.

["G"-sus!]

I just wanted to say that personally (I'm sure others agree), I would have NEVER have known AF existed if it wasn't for g20.net!
g20.net helped me out before I was introduced to AF.

I don't about all the other he said, she said, but I know b-boogie/G-Forces gave me more help than anyone. So when they put a forum on the g20.net site--I say where's the wrong there?

HAHA you guys are like 2-live crew...banned in the U.S.A.F I wonder if your names are available now

This is funny, it's like a soap opera!

[G-loads]

...I think it's time to use that "Closed Thread" feature. Enough of this, let's move on........

[b-b00gie]

Agreed.