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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Can anyone on this forum breakdown the whole turbo issue for me?

My car failed the e-test that I knew would happen. I have my eyes set on a Red-Top DET that was out of an automatic AWD car. I want to know a few things before I go ahead with the swap.

I have heard about a few different sr20deT's:

Sylvia Bluebird, a Red valve cover, Pulsar Gti-R, RWD DET, and a Ball bearing turbo, silver valve cover, blue valve cover.

Im not sure if these are the same engines or if I have repeated them. Can someone please help me out to organize this stuff. Im not to sure about this turbo stuff.

1) I'd like to know how I can tell the difference(how to identify)?

2) The power out puts in (hp) and (torque)?

3) I need to know the pros and cons to these engines?

4) Can you tell me which engine is which? red top, blue bird etc

5) Which turbo is on which engine?

I personally have found an engine from
This is the one Im getting:


thanx guys
 

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G20.net Founder
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Dude you asked a mouthful! This is a whole article and I'm not going to write out everything I know so I'll give you the condensed version. You'll have to start doing some research on your own. Like find good pics of the motor so you can tell them apart.

1. You can tell a FWD from a RWD DET by the orientation of the intake manifold inlet. First off the front of the engine is where the pullies are. So the FWD DET has the inlet by the rear of the motor and the RWD has the inlet by the front.

2. GTi-R 230hp --- BB 209hp

3. Pros and cons? Geez is this an essay? Pros: more power. Cons: Used motor, unknown history, more complex, emissions.

4. BB had a black top and GTi-R had a red top.

5. Pulsar GTi-R: T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in standard T-3
housing. 79 trim 53.8mm Inco T-250 turbine wheel .86
A/R turbine housing. Journal bearings.

BB T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in T-04B housing,
62 trim 53.8mm T-25 turbine. .64 A/R turbine housing.
Ball bearing center section.

Hope that helps a bit. Your question are pretty broad and will take a lot of explaining. I think you still need to do some research. I sound like a broken record here but I think it's important.

Hopefully one day we can get all this info up on the site but it's going ot take someone to write it.
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #3
Thanx alot man

So the picture that I posted is a Pulsar GTI-R(red top) and not BlueBird(black top)? How can I differentiate?

If anyone has pics of both engines and can tell me how to visually identify the difference between the engines. That would help alot


Thanx guys (Jason):alien:
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #4
This is also pretty dumb to ask as I think I know the answer.
I was wondering what engine is this as to ask would it fit in my P10?


Intercooled SR20DET:

 

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G20.net Retiree
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G-Forces said:

4. BB had a black top and GTi-R had a red top.
Actually, BB DET's came in both red and black tops. I believe the black top BB DET's are the newer ones.


Additionally, from what I can see both of those pictures appear to be BB DET's.

GTI-R DET's have a different intake manifold than the type shown and also has a much larger intercooler which covers more (almost all) of the valve cover.
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #6
thanx man, if you come across a Gti-r pic could you please post a link to it so I could tell the difference


thanx again
 

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GTA_G20, I just moved to Pickering last fall. Since I've moved here, I've seen a lot more P10s (our model, 91-96 G20s). What color is your car? Maybe I've seen it, mine is black, lowered about an inch and has a roof mounted antenna (cause my power antenna broke).

Anyways, where did you find that motor and how much was it selling for? I'd like to see it in person. I've been contemplating a swap for some time now but I haven't really started looking cause I don't have the funds yet. We should meet up sometime, maybe I could help you out with your emissions problems.
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #8
hhahahaaa

Dude I think you live my street. If you just moved in a few houses down. I'm at 1702. I'm away at university till the end of the month. And I for sure am gonna do the swap. Name is Stewart see you around

I was pissed when I saw yet another P10 within a 100meter radius from my house.

Since u identified urself its cool:dead:
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #9
JG20 said:
GTA_G20, I just moved to Pickering last fall. Since I've moved here, I've seen a lot more P10s (our model, 91-96 G20s). What color is your car? Maybe I've seen it, mine is black, lowered about an inch and has a roof mounted antenna (cause my power antenna broke).

Anyways, where did you find that motor and how much was it selling for? I'd like to see it in person. I've been contemplating a swap for some time now but I haven't really started looking cause I don't have the funds yet. We should meet up sometime, maybe I could help you out with your emissions problems.
Oh yea click on my WWW. to look at the pics of my car. The site is pretty much bare but there is a picture. Im sure ur the guy who moved onto my street.

As for the engines I found (1) for $700 and the price is too good to be true so I am coming home on Monday to check it out. If its as good as it sounds Ima buy that badboy and keep it in my garage(Now that I know u live on my street Ima lock my garage door extra tight)LOL!!
I have found some other DET's for around a thousand bucks through my uncle and if you are serious I can hook you up no doubt.

My car is at home as the tags are expired you'll probably see it although I wont be there. I took my dads car and he's got mine. I'd like your help with the emissions so thanx bro. I'll see ya
 

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GTA_G20 said:
Sylvia Bluebird, a Red valve cover, Pulsar Gti-R, RWD DET, and a Ball bearing turbo, silver valve cover, blue valve cover.
"Red top" and "Black top" are terms generally used to distinguish the different RWD DET engines (and cannot be used in a FWD car). The Syliva is RWD.

The Bluebird SSS and GTi-R are both AWD cars, but we can use them with our FWD cars.

The BB DET comes with red or black valve covers. The older BB DET (U12 - red valve cover) has a top mount intercooler TMIC, and the newer BB DET (U13 - black valve cover) has a FMIC.

Neither comes from the factory with a ball bearing center section.

Never seen a DET with a silver or blue valve cover from the factory. The factory SR20VE valve cover is a translucent blue. Looks great.
 

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G-Forces said:
2. GTi-R 230hp --- BB 209hp
I've always heard/read 237bhp and 205 bhp respectively. Small difference though.

G-Forces said:
BB T-28, 60 trim 60 mm BCI-1 compressor in T-04B housing,
62 trim 53.8mm T-25 turbine. .64 A/R turbine housing.
Ball bearing center section.
Perhaps the newer ones have the ball bearing center section, but I've only heard of that coming on the Sylvia (or is it Silvia?).

Ditto the turbo. The U12 for sure comes with a T25 and not ball bearing center section. The U13 may be different. Boogie?
 

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b-b00gie said:
GTI-R DET's have a different intake manifold than the type shown and also has a much larger intercooler which covers more (almost all) of the valve cover.
Yes, the GTi-R has a short runner intake manifold and quad throttle bodies.

IMHO, the premium for the GTi-R just is not worth it.
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #13
Just the man I was looking for

)Thank you very much to responding to my cries..

I have been trying to find a December issu of SCC since december and by that time it was too late as all the stores here had the January issue on the shelves. I realized after the fact that it was your section of fame and by that time it was too late.

I dont mean to sound repetative and bother you but there were some questions that I needed to get answers too if you wouldn't mind helpin' me out

Here they are:

1)What are the bare minimum thing I need to make my DET operate besides the Sr20DET, ECU and downpipe?
2) Do I need an intercooler and if so what does it do?
3) My supercharged G60 never had an intercooler why do I need one for a turbo?

I just need to know the basics or bare minimums I need to put this engine in to normal driving conditions NOT RACING at all. I plan on doing this next month and dont want to be overwhelmed after the fact of me staring the transplant and the G being off the road for most of the summer
Next summer I plan on adding extras such as computer's and such, turbo timers:)confused:) and a blow off valve:confused:
 

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I have a silver-top SR20DET. It is out of the Avenir. It's very similar to the Bluebird DET, however the newer Avenir ('98+) has a ball-bearing turbo (not sure about the older ones; mine's a
'96 motor and I'm not quite done with the swap). Anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure about this. Oh, the silver-top Avenir DETs also have FMICs.
 

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Oh, also the Avenir motor uses the T25 turbo. The engines with ball-bearing turbos (not sure if those are all, or just newer engines) are also rated a little higher HP - 230ish.

You have to be careful installing this motor in a G however, as I've ran into a couple small problems with the turbo hitting the crossmember and front motor mount (The turbo is positioned different on the manifold, and pointing down for the FMIC, instead of up like on most Bluebirds). We figured out a good solution, though. It's not too bad.
 

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G20 Junkee
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Discussion Starter #16
I knew I read this somewhere b4

g20ps said:
I have a silver-top SR20DET. It is out of the Avenir. It's very similar to the Bluebird DET, however the newer Avenir ('98+) has a ball-bearing turbo (not sure about the older ones; mine's a
'96 motor and I'm not quite done with the swap). Anyone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure about this. Oh, the silver-top Avenir DETs also have FMICs.
Can u get me a FMIC[(front mouth intercooler)I hope I picked that up correctly]if I send you some loot?

Would the FMIC fit the front mouth of a P10?
 

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I don't have another one right now. You're best bet would be to call someone like Hotshot Performance. They have a front mount intercooler kit for the G20. It should include everything - piping, intercooler, etc. Ask Geo about it, I believe he used it on his G.
 

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Re: Re: DET questions

Geo said:

Never seen a DET with a silver or blue valve cover from the factory. The factory SR20VE valve cover is a translucent blue. Looks great.
The VE also come with a black cover too. Both come with a big NeoVVL plate on the so it hard to miss. ;)
 

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Geo said:


I've always heard/read 237bhp and 205 bhp respectively. Small difference though.
:p I was going off the top of my head. Sue me.

Perhaps the newer ones have the ball bearing center section, but I've only heard of that coming on the Sylvia (or is it Silvia?).

Ditto the turbo. The U12 for sure comes with a T25 and not ball bearing center section. The U13 may be different. Boogie?
Oops I grabbed the wrong ratings for the BB turbo. :bored: Here are the correct ratings.

T-25, 60 trim 56mm BCI-1 compressor, 53.8mm 62 trim T-25 turbine, .64 A/R turbine housing. Journal bearings.:cheeky:
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Nice

But can u explain the intercooler question for me J?
 
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