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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Now... these may seem like a preliminary questions, but it's more like confirmation ones... I need this information for a certain record, so I need them to be appropriate. :)
What are the differences in HP between these engines (BB, GTI-R, Avenier)? Why is the Avenier DET more expensive than the GTI-R? and the GTI-R more expensive than the Bluebird DET? Can an aftermarket Turbo be added to replace the 'stock' ones...? Which one would best fit a P10 and a P11? Please share your knowledge!
Thanx already for your help... ;)

B.
 

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Avenir = GTI-R = 225 hp
Bluebird = 205

As for the prices I have no clue as I haven't seen an avenir or a gti-r in Canada.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
here

Try this: JGY Customs ... That's where I got the idea of these engines being more expensive than others...
Also... The 225HP or 205HP... is that just the DET with no other mods added to it?...
They also have the S13 and S15 engines listed... Are those the ones from the Silvias (240SX)? Are they more powerful? Or are they the RWD motors?
 

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Yes, the RWD motors are tuned more sportily. They belong in sport coupes after all. The above-200hp power figures sound about right for a stock DET. That's at the flywheel though. How much gets to the wheels will be a reasonably lower figure.

I'd assume the price differences are a reflection of the engine's rarity. Supply and demand y'know. There were a lot more Bluebird SSS on the road than the Pulsar GTiRs. Weren't the Pulsar GTiRs simply rally homologations so Nissan could use them in competition?
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Cool

Okay... so the 200+ figures are for the 'stock' DET at the flywheel... And the Avenir and GTI-R are the same... quite powerful if you ask me... Oh well....
Thanx for clearing that up for me guys... I was a bit confused, and that's the kind of info I need down packed for my report! :)
 

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if i remember correctly and please correct me if i err, the gtir's were only around from 1990 to 1993-4?? the gtir's motor is the rnn14 model of the sr20det. it is different than the other 2 and i think harder to swap. it has the quad throttle intake mani, a t28 turbo, and larger injectors. i just found out on another post that the quad throttle body intake mani can't be swapped between the other sr's but that it is likely that the heads can be.
 

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Platy's quite right. A GTi-R swap is not to be taken lightly, compared to a Bluebird/Avenir swap, which is barely harder than a standard JDM swap, according to some vendors. A GTi-R can also handle quite a bit more power than the other two can.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
WOW

Comes with a T28?... wow... Obvioulsy it is more powerful... Now I understand why the GTI-R is relatively more expensive... I wonder what the average mileage is on them... and I also wonder about the ones 'JGY Customs' are selling.... :paranoid:
.........
maybe a head job could make it easier to keep the 'Quad' manifold...
BTW... define 'Quad Intake Manifold'...
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Crazy and Off topic...

I saw somethin' crazy once... it was in an issue of 'Super Street', I'll look it up again... it was this Civic CRX... the engine looked pretty hot... but what really caught my attention, was the fact that it had 'individual throttle bodies' for each injector/cylinder... yup... four TBs attached to replace the usual manifold... I'll look up the details for you guys... :paranoid:
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
here

Try this: Drag CRX
Or if you go to "Superstreetonline", go their featured cars, you'll find a CRX titled "Smoking Signal" and you'll see what I'm talking about... And please understand that I'm not trying to praise the Honda... but rather pointing out the idea behind having 'individual TBs' on a hot motor....... :)
 

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yup that's what is so awesome about the gtir's intake mani.

in terms of mileage, just imagine a 1990-93 car and the average mileage it would have.

just remember what cowboy was saying. this is a difficult swap. most people avoid it and go after the bbdet's and avenir's because those motors share more parts with our de's. you're going to have more difficulty trying to find parts for the gtir.

in terms of bbdet and avenir, these motors tend to be newer. i think the avenir is just set to run higher boost to the same figures of the gtir and the turbo points in a different direction. it also has a fmic instead of the bbdet's top mount.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
well

Well it's the usual case... the more power you want the more work and money you have to put in... but nowadays, everything's possible ...:paranoid:
 

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Hi. This is the info I`ve got:

Bluebird= 205hp U13-92-96 t25 fmic

Avenir= 225 hp W10- 96-98 t25 fmic
w11- 98- t25 ballbearing, fmic

I`m going for an Avenir swap in my Primera because it`s
a newer engine and got more hp than the BB. More
expensive than the BB, but cheaper than the GTI-r.
Interchangeable parts with the sr20 de.
The latest engines also got ballbearing turbo.
 

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You mean engine numbers? Don`t know?

Visuals:

I think all bluebird`s got burgundy valve covers.

The Avenir W10 96-98 got alloy cover and W11 98-onw got black
cover.
The turbo on the avenier sits a little different from the BB turbo.
 

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You're lucky haavja, there in Europe you have access to so many kinds of SR20DET. In the US, there are no Avenirs or Wingroads or any of those other cars/wagons that hold SR20DETs. As a matter of fact, we don't have SR20DETs at all, and the only cars that hold SR20DEs (n/a) are B13/B14/B15 Sentra and P10/P11 Primera. The market really sucks here and we don't have many options.

Does the Avenir SR20DET have many advantages over the Bluebird SR20DET?
 

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N14 and U12 are top mounted

U13 are newer Bluebird 92-96 and are front mount, T25, 207hp

N14 comes with T28, non Ball-bearing
stronger head, stronger rods, 4 trottle bodies, sodium filled valves, the top mounted intercooler won't clear most of our se-r's hood once closed. You have to invert +/- of injectors and +/- of TPS. You have to widen the flywheel bolt holes of 2 hundreths of an inch.

And once you've all done that, you still have to get it working!

In my opinion, you better go with a BB and spend the additional money on upgrades such as cams (which you won't be able to do with a GTi-R, well... less easily). As for turbo, you can always change it after the swap. That's what I'm doing. I'm upgrading for a Skyline T28.


S13, S14 and S15 sr20det come from Silvia and 180sx.
S13 has 205hp, like our U12-13
S14 has 220hp
S15 has 250 (T28 ball bearing (like skylines)
 

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Well, drifter, actually we haven`t got access to any fwd DET.
We got the GTI-R and the rwd 200sx that`s it. Almost
impossible to find used DET parts.
Not shure, but I think the Avenier is only sold in Japan.

I guess I`ll be getting my Avenier engine from Australia.
Around the globe but the prices are nice and the shipping
wasn`t that bad. Seems like that`s the place for Nissan parts.

I think the Avenier DET is based on the same BB DET but
runs higher boost, and got ballbearing turbo in some newer
engines from -98.
It also got fmic.
 

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Wouldent the front mount intercooler be more affective due to the the top mount getting all of the heat fro mthe engine? And also whats the differences between a ball bearing turbo and one without?

All you people in other states are more fourtunate than I. I live in Las Vegas Nv and need to have my car shipped to another state to have it worked on for a swap.:monkey: Hopefully I can find a good shop in Arizona or California.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
man..

... all this information is flowing like fresh clear water ... Mmmh... I really wish I could get my hands on a GTI-R ... I'd mess around with my friend's VR6/SLC Corrado anyday now!! :evil:
 
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